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 Why Exclude The Wii?

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DemonWolf
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PostSubject: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sat Nov 20, 2010 10:16 am

From the start I've always agreed with the fact that we should keep a ps3 vs 360 mentality, though it does make me wonder.
Why don't we include the wii?
Now, there are several answers to this. One is that many people don't see it as a next-gen system. Well, to be honest, aside from the graphics, the gameplay it's capable of is more or less on-par with the average game you get on xbox 360/ps3. If I may draw your attention to this video:
Here you can see that although the shadowing, lighting, colour depth and general graphical quality is far from impressive on the wii, the gameplay looks more or less the same as the ps3 counterpart.
Yes, the wii isn't an HD console but if it has games and some of them are more-or-less the same as those on the other systems, why isn't it included?


Another reason why wii may not be included is because it's casual focused. Perhaps people think a waggle system shouldn't be included in a competitive rivalry between 2 systems that are primarily focused at a hardcore gamer demographic. Yet, the release of Kinect and Move have proven that even Microsoft and Sony are trying to divert their focus onto the family people too. And while the wii does have generally casual first party games, there are many exceptions to the rule. For example:
Legend Of Zelda, The Godfather, Resident Evil, Driver Parallel Lines, Monster Hunter, Call Of Duty, No More Heroes and so on.


There are other possible explanations for excluding the wii. One of them is perhaps exclusives. There are quite a few games on 360 that are shared with wii and no ps3 (and vice versa), such as Super Meatboy and Dead Rising.
By not including the wii, the amount of "exclusives" within the ps3 vs 360 discussion is increased by quite a few. On top of this, the wii tends not to get so much multi-platform third party support compared to the other systems, and therefore it's library offers many unique games not available elsewhere. This is also strengthened due to the fact that Nintendo's first party studios are able to frequently push out AA and AAA standard games like Mario Galaxy and other Mario-related games.


Maybe it's none of the above reasons. Perhaps I've overlooked something.
Why don't we include the wii into the ps3 vs 360 debate?


Discuss.
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sat Nov 20, 2010 11:48 am

That WiiMote is quite cute =3
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sat Nov 20, 2010 12:02 pm

It was included in the beginning. Then people started to realize that even with motion control, 3rd party games were generally better to play on PS3/360 if they were even available on the Wii at all. Even The Force Unleashed which seemed like a perfect match for the Wii ended up being better on 360. There are some exceptions like Tiger Woods that Guitar Hero that worked and sold best on Wii. But if you want to play the latest badass game like borderlands or red dead redemption, you're going to need a HD console. PS3 and 360 are very much alike while Wii is out there in it's own little world.



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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sat Nov 20, 2010 12:31 pm

^
Yeah generally multiplats are inferior on wii but same goes with ps3 vs 360. For the most part, Xbox gets the superior multiplats. But we include the ps3 in the debate rather than exclude it like the wii and bring in the pc.
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sat Nov 20, 2010 12:36 pm

Wii counts too no matter who tries to spin it. the thing is that it won and whenever that happens in a gen 2nd place and 3rd place guys tend to go against each other. Just look at GC vs XBOX last gen or sega saturn vs N64.
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sat Nov 20, 2010 12:40 pm

Spartan v07 wrote:
Wii counts too no matter who tries to spin it. the thing is that it won and whenever that happens in a gen 2nd place and 3rd place guys tend to go against each other. Just look at GC vs XBOX last gen or sega saturn vs N64.

Hey! No one picks one the great N64. That console rocks my socks off.
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sat Nov 20, 2010 6:51 pm

We don't include it because it rarely gets a AAA exclusive such as Halo Reach, Mass Effect 2, Uncharted 2 etc.
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sat Nov 20, 2010 7:19 pm

ghost23 wrote:
We don't include it because it rarely gets a AAA exclusive such as Halo Reach, Mass Effect 2, Uncharted 2 etc.

Mass Effect 2 is coming to the PS3.
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sat Nov 20, 2010 8:32 pm

ghost23 wrote:
We don't include it because it rarely gets a AAA exclusive such as Halo Reach, Mass Effect 2, Uncharted 2 etc.
scratch
There are quite a few AAA games for the Wii.
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sat Nov 20, 2010 8:33 pm

ghost23 wrote:
We don't include it because it rarely gets a AAA exclusive such as Halo Reach, Mass Effect 2, Uncharted 2 etc.

Yes it does...

Most nintendo first party games are AAA or AA
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sat Nov 20, 2010 9:04 pm

Arbiteris wrote:
ghost23 wrote:
We don't include it because it rarely gets a AAA exclusive such as Halo Reach, Mass Effect 2, Uncharted 2 etc.

Yes it does...

Most nintendo first party games are AAA or AA

Yeah i see that but the thing is that most of those games are either Mario or Zelda. I haven't played those games, they most likely are great, but Nintendo needs some new IP's for this generation, and Wii Sports doesnt count. The reason I like PS3/360 more is that because theres new IP's such as Gears or Uncharted that tend to keep things fresh.
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sat Nov 20, 2010 9:46 pm

About the AAA and AA Wii games...Wii games are reviewed at a lower standard than PS3 or 360 games so a AAA Wii game if ported to 360 without any changes other than controls, would be lucky to get a low AA score.
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sat Nov 20, 2010 10:01 pm

BlackStigma wrote:
About the AAA and AA Wii games...Wii games are reviewed at a lower standard than PS3 or 360 games so a AAA Wii game if ported to 360 without any changes other than controls, would be lucky to get a low AA score.

That's not necessarily true.

The only freebees Wii games get for reviews is with graphics since that is more of a hardware issue. If SMG2 was on X360/PS3 it would sill have a AAA score, but it would probably get docked a little for the crappy graphics.
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sat Nov 20, 2010 10:06 pm

Alan1994 wrote:
BlackStigma wrote:
About the AAA and AA Wii games...Wii games are reviewed at a lower standard than PS3 or 360 games so a AAA Wii game if ported to 360 without any changes other than controls, would be lucky to get a low AA score.

That's not necessarily true.

The only freebees Wii games get for reviews is with graphics since that is more of a hardware issue. If SMG2 was on X360/PS3 it would sill have a AAA score, but it would probably get docked a little for the crappy graphics.

More than that, they'd get knocked down for bad AI and small scale. The 360 version of Dead Rising could have 800 zombies on screen at once, the Wii version could only have up to 100 on screen at a time. And well, have you seen the AI for some of the games? And graphics have a pretty big impact on the final score actually. Besides, I remember you said that you love graphics over XBL party chat.
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sun Nov 21, 2010 7:55 am

BlackStigma wrote:
About the AAA and AA Wii games...Wii games are reviewed at a lower standard than PS3 or 360 games so a AAA Wii game if ported to 360 without any changes other than controls, would be lucky to get a low AA score.

I agree. I say that about ds. And multiplatform games prove that. Shit games get like 3/10 on psp and 6/10 on ds. lol

But in some cases like Super Smash Bros or Mario Galaxy, I'm sure the rating would be more or less the same because they're kind of unique games. But otherwise, I'd agree.
Monster Hunter Tri though... that's a reason to own a wii Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sun Nov 21, 2010 12:43 pm

But, when you guys say 360 multiplats are better, it's just graphics.
Or the framerate.

On the Wii, like, it's noticeably worse. The controls and all.

Also, Monster Hunter = average.
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sun Nov 21, 2010 1:13 pm

GrandMasterZillah wrote:
But, when you guys say 360 multiplats are better, it's just graphics.
Or the framerate.

On the Wii, like, it's noticeably worse. The controls and all.

Also, Monster Hunter = average.

u casual
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Sun Nov 21, 2010 4:50 pm

I played the demo for Monster Hunter on PSP and didn't like it. I don't consider myself a casual.
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Tue Nov 23, 2010 3:34 pm

ghost23 wrote:
We don't include it because it rarely gets a AAA exclusive such as Halo Reach, Mass Effect 2, Uncharted 2 etc.

LMAOLMAOLMAOLMAOLMAOLMAOLMAOLMAOLMAO!!
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Tue Nov 23, 2010 6:30 pm

ghost23 wrote:
Arbiteris wrote:
ghost23 wrote:
We don't include it because it rarely gets a AAA exclusive such as Halo Reach, Mass Effect 2, Uncharted 2 etc.

Yes it does...

Most nintendo first party games are AAA or AA

Yeah i see that but the thing is that most of those games are either Mario or Zelda. I haven't played those games, they most likely are great, but Nintendo needs some new IP's for this generation, and Wii Sports doesnt count. The reason I like PS3/360 more is that because theres new IP's such as Gears or Uncharted that tend to keep things fresh.

>>Gears or Uncharted
>>both games involve taking cover and shooting at stuff
>>tend to keep things fresh.

LOL
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Wed Nov 24, 2010 1:46 pm

Pickles wrote:
ghost23 wrote:
Arbiteris wrote:
ghost23 wrote:
We don't include it because it rarely gets a AAA exclusive such as Halo Reach, Mass Effect 2, Uncharted 2 etc.

Yes it does...

Most nintendo first party games are AAA or AA

Yeah i see that but the thing is that most of those games are either Mario or Zelda. I haven't played those games, they most likely are great, but Nintendo needs some new IP's for this generation, and Wii Sports doesnt count. The reason I like PS3/360 more is that because theres new IP's such as Gears or Uncharted that tend to keep things fresh.

>>Gears or Uncharted
>>both games involve taking cover and shooting at stuff
>>tend to keep things fresh.

LOL

Lol, missed that part where he said "keep things fresh." You do realize that 99% of the 360 exclusives are shooters right? OR at least INVOLVE shooting. Halo Reach, Gears, Alan Wake, Splinter Cell, Crackdown, etc all involve a shooting mechanic. The PS3 too, has many shooters but it has a little more variety, but even so: Killzone, Resistance, MGS4, Infamous (has those TPS mechanics), Uncharted, etc.

Mario and Zelda? How about:

Metroid
Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn
Punch Out!!
Sin & Punishmnet 2
Pikmin 3 (not released yet)
Donkey Kong Country Returns
Kirby Epic Yarn

Another thing, why do people think ONLY Nintendo when they think Wii? You do realize that there are 3rd party devs brining quality games to the Wii just like any other platform right?

The Conduit
MadWorld
No More Heroes
Boom Blox
Red Steel
Deadly Creatures

All new IPs made by 3rd-parties, that started on the Wii. And those are just the new IP games....don't make me list ALL of the quality 3rd-party games....

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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Wed Nov 24, 2010 1:51 pm

Shoke wrote:
Pickles wrote:
ghost23 wrote:
Arbiteris wrote:
ghost23 wrote:
We don't include it because it rarely gets a AAA exclusive such as Halo Reach, Mass Effect 2, Uncharted 2 etc.

Yes it does...

Most nintendo first party games are AAA or AA

Yeah i see that but the thing is that most of those games are either Mario or Zelda. I haven't played those games, they most likely are great, but Nintendo needs some new IP's for this generation, and Wii Sports doesnt count. The reason I like PS3/360 more is that because theres new IP's such as Gears or Uncharted that tend to keep things fresh.

>>Gears or Uncharted
>>both games involve taking cover and shooting at stuff
>>tend to keep things fresh.

LOL

Lol, missed that part where he said "keep things fresh." You do realize that 99% of the 360 exclusives are shooters right? OR at least INVOLVE shooting. Halo Reach, Gears, Alan Wake, Splinter Cell, Crackdown, etc all involve a shooting mechanic. The PS3 too, has many shooters but it has a little more variety, but even so: Killzone, Resistance, MGS4, Infamous (has those TPS mechanics), Uncharted, etc.



no. 360 shooters have the spotlight. Doesnt mean they are 90+% of 360s offerings. The ps3 having more variety is BS at best and propaganda at worst. Just because nothing sells as good as Halo or COD means PS3 has variety????? lol cmon

XBLA provides 360 with the variety you look for....hell just see the good ones in 2010 on my channel or here. But I guess your only filtering, talking about retail-only games.


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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Wed Nov 24, 2010 2:13 pm

Quote :
no. 360 shooters have the spotlight. Doesnt mean they are 90+% of 360s offerings. The ps3 having more variety is BS at best and propaganda at worst. Just because nothing sells as good as Halo or COD means PS3 has variety????? lol cmon

99% percent was obviously an exaggeration, although, most are still shooters. Lost Odyssey, Viva Pinata, Blue Dragon, Forza, Fable......that's the only QUALITY exclusives I can think of right now that aren't shooters. When you think about it, shooters definitely account for well over more than 50% of the 360's quality library.

Quote :
XBLA provides 360 with the variety you look for....hell just see the good ones in 2010 on my channel or here. But I guess your only filtering, talking about retail-only games.

You shouldn't have to count on download-able games to provide you with variety. And like I've said before, XBL/PSN/WW titles do not carry the same amount of weight as retail games do. Retail games persuade people to buy a console, not XBL games. I see arguing download-able titles as desperation, because if you have so many retail games to argue with, then you shouldn't need to go to XBL/PSN/WW games.

Quote :
The ps3 having more variety is BS at best and propaganda at worst.

The PS3 has more variety and you know it. Saying otherwise is denial. You won't find uniqueness like Little Big Planet and Valkyria Chronicles anywhere else (unless it's on the PSP of course xD). And if you want to count PSN games (cause I know how much you love falling back on XBL games), then I could say Flower, which is pretty much unique as it gets.

A lot of the things we've seen on the 360 we have seen last generation or could've been done last generation - fact. Halo, Fable, Viva Pinata.....where's the new and innovative ideas? Crackdown isn't a current-gen game at all (from a technical and innovative stand-point).....there's just no new variety on the 360. The majority of the 360's library is just beefed-up last-gen games. It may sound fanboyish, but it's the simple truth.

Quote :
no. 360 shooters have the spotlight.

(Not saying you've said otherwise, but) same thing can be said about the Wii. It has TONS more to offer, as I just proved in my previous post, it's just that Mario and Zelda are so juggernaut.
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Wed Nov 24, 2010 3:07 pm

Quote :
99% percent was obviously an exaggeration, although, most are still shooters. Lost Odyssey, Viva Pinata, Blue Dragon, Forza, Fable......that's the only QUALITY exclusives I can think of right now that aren't shooters. When you think about it, shooters definitely account for well over more than 50% of the 360's quality library.

X360: Lost Odyssey, Viva Pinata, Blue Dragon, Forza Motorsport, Project Gotham Racing, Fable, Halo Wars (RTS), Alan Wake, Dead or Alive 4, Kameo, Crackdown, the Ubisoft Naruto games, Splinter Cell Conviction*

* On PC

PS3: Ratchet and Clank, Heavenly Sword, Demon Souls, Heavy Rain, Gran Turismo, inFamous, Motorstorm, Yakuza, Valkyria Chronicles, MGS4, MLB the Show*, LBP, Singstar, God of War

* On PSP and PS2.

OH MAN! The PS3 is DESTROYING the X360's library when it comes to games that aren't shooters.

50% are shooters? Out of your ass maybe. The X360 has the Halo series and the Gears series for it's exclusive shooters. PS3 on the other hand has MAG, Socom, Resistance, and Killzone off the top of my head. If you are counting 360/PC only games then there is the L4D series and Metro 2033.

Quote :
The PS3 has more variety and you know it. Saying otherwise is denial. You won't find uniqueness like Little Big Planet and Valkyria Chronicles anywhere else (unless it's on the PSP of course xD). And if you want to count PSN games (cause I know how much you love falling back on XBL games), then I could say Flower, which is pretty much unique as it gets.

A lot of the things we've seen on the 360 we have seen last generation or could've been done last generation - fact. Halo, Fable, Viva Pinata.....where's the new and innovative ideas? Crackdown isn't a current-gen game at all (from a technical and innovative stand-point).....there's just no new variety on the 360. The majority of the 360's library is just beefed-up last-gen games. It may sound fanboyish, but it's the simple truth.

The X360's library (counting X360 only and X360/PC only games) has atleast one quality game in almost every genre.

FPS: Halo, L4D, Metro 2033
TPS: Gears of War
Racing: Forza Motorsport, Project Gotham Racing.
WRPG: Fable
JRPG: Blue Dragon, Lost Odyssey
Sandbox: Crackdown, (Fable could also be considered a sandbox game)
Action Adventure/horror: Alan Wake
RTS: Halo Wars
Life Simulation: Viva Pinata
Platformer/Vehicle construction: Banjo Kazooie: Nuts and Bolts
Stealth Oriented- Splinter Cell: Conviction


Most of the PS3's game library (PS3 only, not on X360 bla bla bla) are continuations/sequels to last gen titles. LBP is a great, innovative title but it doesn't necessarily make the PS3's library. In fact, I think the PS3 is lacking a decent RTS game.

Do you know what's funny Shokio? You criticized Halo Reach earlier this year for "not doing anything new to the genre", and then praised and defended God of War 3 even though its hardly did anything new to the series itself. Hmmmm?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
On a serious note:
I think the Wii should be included. Anyone who says otherwise is a mad fanboy.
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PostSubject: Re: Why Exclude The Wii?   Wed Nov 24, 2010 3:46 pm

[quote="Shoke"]
Quote :
It may sound fanboyish, but it's the simple truth.

Yeah just like teh ps3 gamerz dont buy their games cause 360 games sell more than em!!Tis might sound fanboyish but its teh simplest truth!!

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